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Looper's Delight
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Mike Biffle wrote: > > Thanks Reg for such clear and devoloped definitions regarding looping. >Most of > my comments are in reply to your feelings about Robert Fripp below. > > Reginald Hunt wrote... > > >The topics below obviously touch on some interesting fundamental points: > > >Music and Artistically Valid Noise > > >Yes I consider them different. Possibly Music is a subset of AVN. Or >they > >are side by side under a larger category(?) For me, method of >production is > >irrelavant to whether I wish or need to hear the final result. Granted, > >Music and AVN are broad subjects. They are not always about a final >sonic > >result per se. But sometimes they are. And sometimes those sonic >results are > >meant to achieve states of mind other than joy, anger, or pathos. Of >course, > >approval of those states of mind is an essentially political choice. > > >By method of production, I refer to technology and technique, and also >to > >the envoronment the work is conceived in. Good work can be produced by > >situations ranging from a lone person in his apartment to a >band/orchestra > >in a live venue. But since the discussion here relates to Looping as the > >technology/technique, I bring up the next point.... > > >>**************************************************************************** > >********* > > >My operating definition of "looping" has been this: > > >Electronically or mechanically repeated time segments of audio. The time > >segments would be at least about 1 second. Obviously, the time segments >must > >be shorter than infinite, or else no repeat occurs. > > >A person sitting at a keyboard and playing the same phrase over and over > >manually is not looping, he is repeating. Yodelling in a canyon is not > >looping, it is echo. The effects can sometimes be similar using any of >the > >three. Which is why I bring up the next point.... > > >>**************************************************************************** > >********* > > >The purpose of looping to me appears to be: > >To create interesting repeating patterns of sound (Music or AVN) easily. > >To create thick layers of sounds unachievable in any any other >economically > >feasable way. > >To create a One-Man-Band. > > >Any uses of looping I've experienced has fallen into one or more of >those > >categories. Notice that I do not include any specific political, > >psychological, or aesthetic goals. Looping in itself is neutral to >these. > >However, any technology or technique has uses that are immediately > >suggested, and others uses that are discovered or developed after >experience. > > >>**************************************************************************** > >********* > > >Unfortunately, the human animal can suffer from the tendency to follow > >sheep-like (or lemming-like). Ambient music has suffered from its >contingent > >of brain dead devotees, as has Fripp. Originally, ambient music was not > >intended as a hypnotic tranquilizer (which looping inherently lends >itself > >to). It was meant as music which operates equally on different levels of > >awareness simultaneously. Persons who assume that loopers are into >ambient > >music by default, are a type of bigot. But don't damn a style of music >for > >that. > > Does this imply that 'bad' ambient music has actually impaired our >ability to > perceive Mr. Fripp? How nasty of the mediocrities. > > I'm not sure how 'ambient' music was originally intended. Was there a >group > charter for the genre or something? Or are we now following sheep-like, >some > authority on the subject? I'd like to think that even the most >unassuming person > who purchases *any* cheesy sounds to alter their environment, is somehow >taking > a rather active measure to alter their experience somehow. Most >commendable! > > Bigot? Let they without sin cast the first stone! Those mindless drones >have > infected us all... Animals indeed! > > >Fripp has always been an acquired taste. His explorations extend beyond > >music per se. He has always questioned the audience-performer >relationship, > >and the effect of the music business on musicians. His actions at > >performances are reflective of all that and probably more. He's never >been > >about being a "hot" player. The many comments I've seen here and >elsewhere > >asking why he doesn't "rip it up", or about him leavng the stage and > >observing the audience, shows a lack of understanding about the artist. > > To believe that I don't understand the artist because I have preferences >as to > what I might experience at a performance seems a little PC to me. I've >been able > to enjoy the vast differences in much of Fripps output. Fripp doesn't >have to > always rip, but if I shell out to go see him, I'm hoping I might get >some tiny > portion that which I know to also be alive somewhere in his soul as >well. After > all the pendulum does swing both ways. > > >Fripp has never been about being a Looper, either. For him it is a >method, > >not the point. Seems to me, that's a good lesson for a lot of us. > > >Reg > > I dislike being boxed in by labels and expectations as well. Did you >study with > Mr. Fripp or what? I have been a Fripp fan and have followed his >techniques and > attitudes quite closely since 'In The Court...'. > > I've found that as I've grown older, I sometimes have to cut to the >chase a > little quicker than I used to. If I lack understanding about Fripp as an >artist > because I hope to see him in a comfortable, non-combative setting, which >might > allow for undistracted listening, then so be it. Let me be 'responsible' >for my > own listening experience without dictating to me. Maybe I'm just an old > intolerant fart as well. Who am I to dictate? > > If lectures become a larger part of other artists performances, I may >begin > having a harder time enjoying them as well. Although I might actually >pursue > some artists due to their engaging communication style and content. I >believe > Fripp is starting to sound redundant to me at this point. Hopefully the >pendulum > will swing again and I will enjoy many more years of delightful Fripp >output. > > I find it somewhat totalitarian though that Fripp expects certain >conformities > from his audience without somehow realizing that his audience might >expect some > regard for their needs as well. Especially having shelled out their >ducats. > > I have my own artistic requirements and expectations of an audience as >well, but > I find that it gets quite complicated when I consider the many possible >ways in > which people listen and communicate. With that in mind I find it a >little harder > to tell them to shut up and listen or some other such dictate. Maybe >when I get > completely fed up with their antics, I'll lay down the law as well. More >power > to Mr. Fripp. > > Loop on brother... > -Miko Biffle > > >>**************************************************************************** > >********* > >>**************************************************************************** > >********* > > From: "Liebig, Steuart A." <LiebigSA@Maritz.com> > To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" <Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com> > Subject: RE: location & Loopers' CD > Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 18:17:26 -0600<>Resent-Message-ID: > <"vt6_M.A.yJF.WJm10"@ferret> > Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > X-Mailing-List: <Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com> archive/latest/2728 > Resent-Sender: SmartList <lists@slip.net> > Resent-To: rphunt@tiac.net > Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 16:29:25 -0800 > > Yeah, I tend to think of loops as being only a small part of the > live/recorded imporvised or composed experience. A small part of the > canvas, sometimes you need to do alot sometimes a little; sometimes > intense noise, sometimes tonal bliss . . . If all you are doing is > looping, well I don't know . . . are you playing music or IC chips? . . > . I only say this because I have friends who have gone this route and > I'm not really sure that it leads to what I consider an important factor > in music: human interaction. (Often have the same problem with totally > pre-recorded concerts or music concrete.) > > > ---------- > > From: Kim Flint > > Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > > Sent: Monday, February 2, 1998 4:04 PM > > To: LiebigSA@maritz.com > > Subject: Re: location & Loopers' CD > > > > At 03:44 PM 2/2/98 EST, paparuda o o wrote: > > > > > > > >yeah! even more, i would actually like to meet other loopers; > > > > I think that is generally a great idea, and probably my biggest > > motivation > > for creating this whole monster of an internet address! Get together! > > Collaborate! Share ideas! Real-live or Virtual! Go forth and Multiply! > > > > > > (pun intended there....) > > > > > > >it's seems to me that most of the loopers are into "ambient" > > >instrumental music. > > > > I'm not. In fact, I'm morally opposed to being an ambient musician. > > What > > others choose to do with their lives is their own business, but I > > resolutely > > refuse to have anything to do with this ambient stuff. I'm deeply > > offended > > by any implication that being into looping means I'm ambient. I'm > > proud of > > my long history here resisting the ambient tyranny that threatens to > > overcome all other loopists! I will also continue to resist shameless > > idol > > worship of this Fripp fellow. Soundscapes, poundcakes. Not for me! > > > > of course, neither of those is as sick as being a deadhead. Those > > maniacs > > are actually planning to open a Grateful Dead theme park in San > > Francisco. > > The apocalypse will arrive none too soon. > > > > this, of course, gets many smiley's: :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) > > > > > > >so, please, if you have a copy of the "loopers CD", or > > >would like to share your (COPYRIGHT protected) looped music > > >can you let me know? > > > > that CD project actually is not yet completed. As I understand, it's > > in a > > bag on someone's shelf awaiting arrival of the still-vaporware-Layla > > sound > > card. Seems likely that CD #2 will arrive before CD #1. > > > > kim > > _______________________________________________________ > > Kim Flint 408-752-9284 > > Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com > > Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com > > > > i dont want this shit