Support
Looper's Delight
|
Support |
|
|
Cliff,
Fortunately, since i synchronize on a subdivision of the beat, i can write
down what i do in standard western musical notation. When i am done with my
latest piece, if you want, i will send you a NIFF file of the composition.
The LIME tool is a good viewer/editor/player for NIFF.
--greg
-----Original Message-----
From: Clifford Novey [SMTP:clifsound@earthlink.net]
Sent: Friday, January 22, 1999 1:18 AM
To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com
Subject: Re: dual loop technique?
Sorry to quote such a lengthy post but I had to respond to the
following
description.
Greg, I like the sound of your idea- but it gets very cerebral to
me
with it all
in writing- how about an example made available on your website (if
you have
one, if you are able)
I just cant "think through it" without simply wanting to HEAR what
you are
talking about-
Only a suggestion...
It makes me think of J. McLaughlin- the odd times and another
pattern merging
with the first- (I love McLaughlin)
Cliff
Greg Meredith wrote:
> Bob,
>
> i work with a single JamMan. However, when i do multiple loops, i
often do
> it manually. That is, i do it using polyphonic instruments, e.g.
stick or
> piano, and/or i employ multiple players. So, this may or may not
be on
> target as the kind of technique in which you might be interested.
>
> However, what i do is to think very much about the 'phase'
structure of the
> piece. i relate each loop to a common tick (finest audible
subdivision of
> the beat). But, i try to emphasize a different pulse in each
loop.
This
> gives the soloist or improvisational voice the opportunity to mix
pulses. i
> look to create loops where the different pulses get maximally out
of phase
> and then come together for a kind of tension-release effect.
>
> For example, i may have one loop with a strong 5/4 pulse and
another with a
> strong 4/4 pulse. If the shortest note (in both loops) is an
1/8th
note,
> then they are synchronized by an 1/8th note tick. In this case,
if
both
> loops are 1 measure long, then they would come together every 40
ticks
> (assuming the measures don't repeat internally). i then try to
write my
> loops to maximize the tension, via harmonic structure,
dissonance,
dynamics,
> etc. just before the 41st tick, and then resolve on the 41st
tick.
>
> This technique gets more interesting when the loops are more than
one
> measure long. In the example above, 40 ticks is 5 measures of
4/4,
and 4
> measures of 5/4. That is, if we repeat a single measure of 4/4 5
times it
> will line up exactly with a loop that repeats a single measure of
5/4 4
> times. If we then make the 5/4 loop be two measures long, each
measure
> observably distinct, then we don't have a real line up, i.e.
pulse
and note
> values line up, until 80 ticks go by. But, we have the pulses
lining up at
> the 40 tick mark. Similarly, every 20 ticks there is a mini-"node
point",
> where a subdivision of the beats of the two loops come together.
By playing
> with mounting the tension and resolving, slightly on these
internal node
> points, you can create really interesting effects.
>
> Note: i have intentionally left out what i think increases
tension
because i
> think that's different for different ears. Tritones, for example,
make me
> happy.
>
> Another interesting technique is to create an 'outer' loop which
uses the
> inner loop as 'events'. So, we could use the same 5 against 4
structure in
> the example above as a guide for triggering the 5/4 loop or the
4/4 loop.
> The question you have to decide is the duration of the event. If
you set it
> equal to the duration of the longest loop, you only get the loops
playing at
> the same time every 20 'events'. If you set it shorter, you get
more
> overlap.
>
> (This approach, imho, seems much a much more promising
application
of
> fractals to music. The dimension along which the piece is
self-similar is
> time. The application above says what happens to the structure of
the piece
> as you increase the time dimension. Clearly, you see a similar
structure. As
> you diminish time, the same thing out to happen. More
specifically, as you
> diminish the time, you get closer to the pulse of the frequencies
that give
> rise to our experience of the note. My (untested!) belief is that
if this
> pulse is related by a number of iterations of an IFS to the
musicians
> experience of the basic pulse(s) of the piece, then you get
appealing
> noise.)
>
> Finally, it may seem to many that one must relate each loop to a
common
> tick. But, i would suggest to a person that feels this way to
listen to the
> work of Conlon Nancarrow, who uses player pianos to do looping
and
other
> interesting and related things. He sets the rhythmic
relationships
between
> the voices (take this to mean a generalized notion of a loop) to
be
> non-integral numbers. In fact, some of his pieces have voices
progressing
> with respect to each other at a rate measured by a transcendental
number
> (i.e., it's not even rational).
>
> i hope this helps.
>
> --greg
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Bob Campbell [SMTP:astropulse@hotmail.com]
> Sent: Wednesday, January 20, 1999 11:08 PM
> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com
> Subject: dual loop technique?
>
> I'm interested in hearing ideas about how 2 loop devices
> can be used creatively together. I use JamMan's so am
specifically
> interested in exploiting that device, but any generic
technique
> ideas are of interest.
>
> Bob
>
> ______________________________________________________
> Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com