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Disclaimer: None of the effects mentioned in the following post can loop by themselves, but the relevance depends on the length of your patch cords. Hi Larry, At 07:45 PM 10/22/99 -0400, you wrote: >The converse is also true... After I wrote: ... A lot of pedals marketed as vibratos are actually >>tremolos. And I'm wondering which pedals you're referring to. I'm not really disagreeing with you; I just can't think of any. The Rocktek Vibrator is a tremolo, as are the Boss TR-2, the Dunlop TS-1, the Ibanez TL-5, the Rocktron Surf, the Dunlop TVP-1, etc. The channel on a lot of vintage Fender amps that says "Vibrato" features a tremolo (although I'm fairly sure the old Vibrosonic and a couple of others did actually have what Fender called a "harmonic" vibrato). The "vibrato" on some old Selmers featured a cool little light that pulsed in time with, you guessed it, the tremolo. Vox amps had a very distinctive sounding tremolo with a nice hard on-off pulse, yet the trade name for this feature was VibroVox. Dual-duty pedals like the Carl Martin Trem O'Vibe offer tremolo and actual pitch modulation vibrato, as supposedly does the Marshall VT-1, although I haven't checked this one out. Some pedals (e.g. Rocktron's Purple Haze) have both distortion and phase-shifting circuitry, which can modulate kind of like a vibrato, but they're not. And they're not calling it a tremolo, either. Then there are the Lovetone Doppelganger, the Uni-Vibe, the RotoVibe, and so forth... Leslies, even, taking advantage of the Doppler effect. But none of these say "tremolo" on 'em. I'm sure there are isolated examples of "tremolos" which do actually modulate pitch, and I agree that the terminology has often been used interchangeably, but to say "most so called tremolo pedals are actually vibrato pedals" as was stated at the beginning of this thread is patently untrue. I wish we COULD all get real pitch-modulating vibrato pedals for twenty bucks apiece, but it's just not gonna happen... Tim