Re: Discuss Amongst Yourselves....

["Clifford@BienAppraisers" <bienappraisers@mindspring.com>]

I keep pressing record on my EDP footpedal but this thread just won't quit-
time to turn it OFF- (off list that is)

Cliff

-----Original Message-----
From: Liebig, Steuart A. <LiebigSA@Maritz.com>
To: 'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com' <Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com>
Date: Thursday, March 09, 2000 10:00 AM
Subject: RE: Discuss Amongst Yourselves....


>I eally hate to sound like a know-it-all, but...
>If you read your history again, the French Revolution was *not* rational,
>or a product of enlightenment thinking in the same way as the American
>Revolution, and note the different results.
>
>** i don't think that i was implying that they were rational, only that
what
>they did was IN THE NAME of rationality; big difference. they were most
>certainly anti-religious (got to the popes' palace in avignon and you'll
see
>what i mean).
>
>The fatal flaw was the
>irrational notion of Egalitarianism, or equality, which is the opposite
>of Freedom and individualism. It's also nonsense to hold up Stalin and
>Hitler as rational and non-religious - Hitler was Catholic (never
>excommunicated, BTW) and a deep Mystic - into the whole Spear of Destiny
>thing.
>
>** i've read the "spear of destiny" and it's interesting, but to be taken
>with a large grain of salt. some serious "truth" needs to be thought about
>when reading that book, lots of mystical mumbo-jumbo in that one - -
>interesting that you would use THAT example to back your viewpoint up. if
>you read about the nazi propaganda machine, you'll find that the idea was
to
>cut the people off from the religion and develop hitler as a the center of
a
>new religion. (by the way if you read my post, you'd see that i mentioned
>the idea of hitler being a mystic - - but many of those underneath the top
>guys  - - goring probably wasn't - -  were not that way. "hitler was a
>choirboy," i've seen the tony alamo posters too! love that you're using
>that.)
>
>it seems like rationality has a very specific and ego-centric definition
for
>you.
>
>Stalin was a Russian Orthodox man to the end too. Both Communism
>and Nazism are irrational quasi-religious beliefs which simply substitute
>'Society' for 'God' in the tyranny equation set down by the monarchs who
>came before them.
>
>** stalin razed a lot of russian orthodox churches. i'd say that all 
>you've
>pointed out that is people will kill a lot of people in the name of
"truth."
>i view stalin as more of a czar to the end . . .
>
>
>is your point: organized religion bad? sure i'd go along with that, FOR 
>ME,
>a lot of the time. that equation doesn't work for everyone.
>
>> Live and let live, I say, but don't let an untruth slip
>> by. Integrity requires it.
>
>> ** truth . . . what IS truth? i see a person's truth based on his/her
>belief
>> system. sorry, i don't believe in absolutes; <snip>
>
>No absolutes huh? Jump off a skyscraper someday. Gravity's a bitch.
>
>** talk about specious . . .
>
>i'd bet you that most hindus (who was slagging their belief system?), or
>"new-agists" would agree that jumping off that building would have that
>effect . . . i believe you used a little dig to belittle a point of view
>that you cared not to discuss a little more civilly . . . too bad. i
believe
>that we were talking about the "hokiness" of some people's belief systems 
>.
>. . or at least some people's perceptions of that "hokiness" . . .
>
>** my belief is this: the real problem is that people get too caught up in
>their version of the "truth" and are ready to kill for it all too often; 
>it
>seems to be more important to be right (and possibly a know-it-all) than 
>it
>is to really deal with issues. (see american political system nowadays . .
.
>)
>
>- Larry (the reluctant know-it-all) :)
>
>** reluctant?
>
>stig
>