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Yes, some free improv guys are actually annoyed when you toss in a loop at them, especially if it has some (yak) rhythmic content.... But admittedly the most basic and easy to operate loopers work best in that kind of a situation, especially those old pitch shifted loops. BTW, has anybody tried to loop on this newly released HIWATT tape echo? It's supposed to do 2000ms, does it pitch shift? Reminds me of my old Korg stage echo.... Also in free improv you should be able to instantly repeat anything you were just playing. Thanks for the input on 20th century composers, I'd like to add anything by Sofia Gubaidulina, especially the orchestra stuff. andreas