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Rick, thanks much for the reading, and listening recommendations. I've always been attracted to Zen thoughts, and the Cage book definitely made me more interested. I need to hear more of his music! looping...I think there are some looping connections in JC's work. In Fripp's solo looping pieces, I always find the silences to be as profound as the notes; and in that and other looping works, the passage of time between recognizable repetitions carries a lot of weight. Also I know personally I enjoy the element of chance in looping; it's near-impossible to predict what will happen as one's playing is trapped in time and repeatedly brought back to be combined with the present. JC (and other folks of the 30's and 40's) liked to take familiar noises, like traffic, and put them in a different context to change the perception of the original. I think that's kinda like looping; a phrase can quickly become familiar, and as things are added to it or the original is morphed into something else, the original retains it's familiarity but becomes something else. cagily, Daryl Shawn highhorse@mhorse.com