Re: where to compress?

[Dave Stagner <dave@spnz.org>]

Evan Meyers wrote:
>>Placement-wise, my compressor is the first device in
>>the analog effects chain. 
> 
> 
> i tried that.  i'm using an EBS multicomp stomp box
> for my bass.  i've found that in the beginning of my
> chain, it defeats the purpose of dynamic based effects
> like envelope generators and filters.  i've been
> playing around with it after those effects and it
> seems pretty good...because it brings out those
> effects and it limits the extreme sounds created by
> some of my filter devices (i'm a big fan of sweeping
> the cutoff frequency and turning the resonance up to
> 11, which can blow most any speaker).

Yeah, if you're using dynamic-based effects like that, then definitely 
put the compressor afterward.  The problem is, the compressor amplifies 
noise quite effectively too, and filter effects are often noisy. :(

> people really use those dan electro pedals?  i always
> looked at them as the pedals for a beginner player
> since you can get a whole set of them for about $100. 
> but then again, there are certain pedals that give
> sounds that nothing else comes close to and they can
> be cheapies too!  i'd part ways with your noisy dan
> electro wah...vox and dunlop make fantastic wah pedals
> and i've even had great success using morley (which
> seems to be on the not so hot list as far as quality
> gear goes).  wah pedals are under $100 these days and
> when movie prices are crackin $10 (i live in
> manhattan), there is little debate as to where the
> money should go.

Heh.  My cheapo Danelectro wah is nestled in between a pair of $200+ 
handmade boutique boxes (Blackbox Oxygen and Prescription Electronics 
Germ).  I paid $29 for it new at Guitar Center.  Whatever works. :}  It 
seems to have a sharper filter than the Crybaby and other Vox clones, 
and i can get ring modulator-like behavior out of it.  I use it for 
playing melodies within feedback.  Maybe someday it'll be replaced with 
a boutique pedal, but for now i find it very useful. There's a sample of 
the Danelectro wah doing its thing at 
<http://www.spnz.org/musick/trapped.ogg>, my first really good loop 
recording since i started putting together a studio.

And don't knock the modern Danelectro pedals!  Yeah, they're cheaply 
made, but so were old Electro-Harmonix pedals.  And they're often 
one-dimensional, but so were many classic vintage pedals (Tube Screamer 
anyone?)... you get the idea.  I can think of several more i might add 
to my rig at some point, something i can't say about Boss or most other 
"quality" pedal manufacturers.

>>Besides, the Oxygen includes a noise gate that works
> 
> 
>>quite well if i keep the initial noise levels 
>>reasonable.  I'm also finding neat effects using 
>>the compressor and its gate along with distortion,
>>and very light tapping - it makes little explosive 
>>noises that just disappear afterward.  It'll take 
>>some time to learn to control this, tho.
> 
> 
> i bet that sounds interesting.  i've always been a fan
> of working with what you have to find out how it can
> be incorporated and it seems like you've found that.

I pretty much treat effects as instruments in their own right. It makes 
me *very* picky about them.  I have to learn to play a pedal just like i 
play the guitar or drums or synth.  My effects are a weird mix of 
boutique pedals, vintage, and just cheap stuff that works.

>>The main motivation for getting a compressor was to
>>even out my fingerpicking tone - bare fingers plus 
>>overdrive equals uneven tone.  It matters for 
>>looping only because it makes my tone better in 
>>general.  Its other uses, like explosive tapping, 
>>are more a matter of how i abuse effects for my own 
>>nefarious ends than how a more normal musician would
>>do things.
> 
> 
> compression is great because it brings out the quieter
> notes and limits the louder smashed notes.  and with
> filter effects, you can get extreme volume jumps which
> suck in a loop.

Limiting is more important to me than compression - i don't mind so much 
that quiet notes are quiet so much as loud notes are too loud.  The 
Oxygen does an excellent job with that.  I may fool around with my 
signal chain and see if it will work with the Germ (my overdrive) first, 
and the Oxygen second.  I'm not sure whether the dynamic problems i have 
with fingerpicking and overdrive are a matter of input or output.  But 
who knows?  The Oxygen is still new to my signal chain, and it'll take a 
while to learn how to play it.

>>In short, put the compressor first.
> 
> 
> i disagree.  but i think it depends on your setup. 
> i'd say put the compressor wherever you want your tone
> evened out...could be good in the middle or at the
> end, or even in the beginning, but i think it is more
> dependant on what you are using.  compressing before
> an envelope filter defeats its purpose completely.

You're right, of course.  Take all declarative statements with a grain 
of salt, especially mine!  But you have to keep the noise monster in 
mind, though.  Some effects produce fairly musical self-noise (my MXR 
flanger and Danelectro wah as cases in point), but others can be pretty 
icky (like the Digitech delays i got rid of long ago).  I'd at least put 
the compressor as close to the front of the signal chain as possible, to 
reduce noise problems.