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So your definition of pro or non-pro is entirely based on the economics. Which would make somebody living off welfare and at the same time trying to get somebody interested in their entirely unprofessional art is a professional, while somebody like e.g. Bryan Beller (of Mike Keneally/Beer for Dolphins, Z, Steve Vai, Mullmuzzler/Jamie LaBrie etc.) isn't (or at least hasn't been until shortly). -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- Von: Travis Hartnett [mailto:travishartnett@gmail.com] Gesendet: Sonntag, 16. Oktober 2005 17:45 An: Loopers-Delight@loopers-delight.com Betreff: Re: Building a rackmount looping computer as an alternative to the Receptor for Mobius In the world of musicians, the term "professional" gets thrown around with abandon, and is often used to denote how "serious" someone is in their musical endeavours. I'm not intending a slight to musicians who can't make ends meet soley through their music, I'm just applying a more precise definition than is often used. A guy who works as a waiter while putting himself through college can be described as a professional waiter, or even a student, but not as a "professional architect", even if he's attending architecture school, and even if he really, really likes to draw buildings and has his own drafting table and a large collection of pencils. As far as I'm concerned, the same applies to musicians. Your "profession" is what you make your living at, your self-definition can be an entirely different thing. "Turning pro" usually means "I've quit my day job". If you've got a W-2 with something other than "musician" listed on it, you're semi-pro. It doesn't mean that you're less of a musician, just that your involvement in the economic realm of music-making is below a certain threshold. TravisH On 10/16/05, paul <phaslem@wightman.ca> wrote: > Travis, I really am surprised by your very narrow definition of a > professional musician! I made my sole living playing music for over > ten years, I don't consider myself any less professional now. I think > anyone who is taking their music seriously, is expected to be paid > when asked to perform, is a professional musician. That may make an > interesting question to ask, How do you define what a professional > musician is? By your definition, I guess that I couldn't even be > called a professional plumber since I don't make enough to cover our > bills and need my wife to supplement our income.