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>>>for some of us it just happens that our music pushes the hardware to the limit, I guess we want to create music that couldn't have happened before.<<< that's great. I'm very interested in finding out what's possible with a particular set up, exploring possibilities etc. It's just that when it comes to actually playing for an audience, or recording music that provides the soundtrack to my life, the cleverness of the looping comes in a very poor 10th behind 9 levels of musical considerations. That's not to say that clever looping tricks and musicality don't overlap - they clearly do sometimes! - but for me it's a matter of priorities. I've heard clever looping that works as music and I've heard clever looping that sounds like crap (to me). It's the same with every musical sub-set I guess. I dislike most of it. Fortunately, there's so much music out there that I could buy a new CD every day for the rest of my life and not run out of world class music to listen to. :o) cheers Steve www.stevelawson.net - site www.stevelawson.net/store/ - shop http://steve.anthropiccollective.org - blog www.myspace.com/solobasstevelawson