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About films - who knows films that contain logical loops or at least repetitions as a main ingredient? The one that comes to my mind immediately is Groundhog Day of course. Also, a very good (IMO) German film called "Run Lola Run" by Tom Tykwer - it shows three variations of the same plot, with small changes in the beginning leading to a different outcome every time. Actually I brought this up just to show that even OT topics might lead back to being on topic. I doubt that opening a second mailing list just for off topic discussions would work so well, and is worth the effort. -Michael www.michaelpeters.de