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Hey Paul, I went back and read every single post you made in this current thread. Every one seemed condescending and judgemental. Everyone was argumentative and challenging. My feathers didn't get ruffled because over the years similar posts have come and gone, but I could tell that you were both spoiling for a fight and that you'd get one. In addition your profess to really dislike this list. So, from a very calm and rational place, I have two pieces of advice for you having been a long time member of this community and having tried really hard to promote the notion of live looping. It's gratuitous advice so you don't have to take it, but I'll proffer it just in case it's helpful 1) You can lower the anger quotient, relax a little and be a contributing, proactive member of this community (you know, making the kinds of posts that you really wished you'd see more often here; sharing some of your music so it can be appreciated, building bridges to all the wonderful benefits that this community has to offer- like knowledge, wisdom, the ability to exchange creativity with other musicians, the ability to travel and play with other like minded musicians etc. and lastly, the ability to be appreciated and accepted as an artist and a human being as most human beings have the desire for.) or 2) You can stop spinning your wheels and unsubscribe so that the huge majority of the people on this list can get back to talking about the things we love most. Either way, I wish you well. Rick Walker Y2K9 International Live Looping Festival