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On Tue, Sep 1, 2009 at 11:20 AM, Gareth Whittock<buddhamachine@live.co.uk> wrote: > I'm curious as to what you think when you guys listen back to recordings >of > your own performances. I've recorded some jams which I thught were quite > acceptable while I was playing them, only to fell that they fell well >short > of expectations whilst just listening. I agree. Listenening to recordings of live improvised music isn't the best way of enjoying it. Better standing their in the room and experience the energy as it happens. But sometimes the "improvisation energy" makes it into a recording. Check out Kulu Se Mama for an example of a great live jam recording! http://www.allaboutjazz.com/php/article.php?id=5991 People talk about The Greatful Dead as "a great jam band" but although I have been listening to some live recorded stuff I don't find in there much of the communicative sensibility I tend to like in improvised music. So maybe "The Dead" is a bad example? I like it when you clearly hear how musicians are looking for common ground to unite in harmony or even being obstructive and destroying every component that could have caused "good music" to form. The Grand Wazoo by Zappa is a nice take on composing and arranging those processes, but it is more fun IMHO to hear it done by improvisation - even though fifty percent of the notes fall outside the proper scale/key. One important point is that improvisation definitely needs structure! This is not saying the music needs structure. No matter if players follow or avoid the structure, there is always a structure as a musical backbone because music can not exist without being about something, expressing something. If there isn't a structure, expression, direction, movement... well, then the musicians simply play bad and should immediately stop to start a new piece in a better mode. Eh... maybe you're post hints at those embarrassing occasions when playing is bad and for some reason doesn't stop? ;-) l-o-l For the record; I totally get Garteh's initial point in this thread. Hearing his wonderful concert back at the Zürich Looping Festival I I found it especially cool that the music he performed on duo was well prepared to sound great, arranged with defined areas for improvisation to take off. I look at that as related to how you work with pop or if "playing for fans when having records out". It brings a different energy than the improvisational flow IMHO. Greetings from Sweden Per Boysen www.boysen.se www.perboysen.com