Re: OT The Sub Pulse was West African/African Diaspora rhythms: 3/4,4/4, 6/8, 12/8

["Mark Showalter" <folkstone57@operamail.com>]

> 
> hey let's hear it.I am curious to learn. So is Mark he just has that 
>British
> humor about him.

Very good observation Anthony & yes I am a big fan of British humor, 
especial Monty Python.

> Antony Hequet
> 
> ***************************************************
> 
> 
> I really don't want to get you wrong (and please correct me if I'm 
>mistaken),
> but what I am
> understanding about your stance here is that you seem to be 
> dismissively telling
> us
> that you don't understand a musical level of sophistication that is 
>understood
> by
> tens of thousands of groove musicians around the planet (whether they 
>use the
> term
> 'sub pulse' or not) and that you profess to have no desire to 
> educate yourself,
> or
> grow further as a musician, merely because it is a concept that was 
> not included
> in
> your entirely Euro-centric (albeit rigorous and valuable) education about
> musical styles.

Hm....in fact, I think what I was going for was that I am clearly ignorant 
of many things, one being what a "sub-pulse" is & another example I gave 
of clearly not having augmented sixths in my head, which I don't. As for 
"Euro-centric" I'm not exactly sure where you came up with that one from 
as I am a big fan of oriental/Indian music & rhythms & both Ravi Shankar & 
his daughter are amazing musicians even though I have no problem admitting 
that I have a hard time getting their sound in my head as well because I 
simply don't understand it, even though I love the music. As for being 
"dismissive", that was not my intention. I was rather trying to avoid 
another flurry of emails about what a "sub-pulse" is because I have 
noticed a tenancy in these discussions to get so far off topic that I find 
it almost impossible to get any kind of idea of what the discussion is 
really about. If you'd like to start an email about what a "sub-pulse" is 
that would be great & I would welcome the chance to learn something new. 
My statement about several drummers/percussionists attempting to explain 
the idea to me & my example of the poor fellow who took the trip with 
Albert Einstein was meant to illustrate my own current problem with 
understanding what my drummer/percussionists friends were trying to 
explain to me. 

> I certainly have respect for the 8 years you spent studying Harmony and 
>Melody
> in a rigorous academic environment.

Thank you although it wasn't that rigorous actually. And my emphasis was 
Theory & Composition, not Harmony & Melody.
 
> I just find it curious that you don't seem to have the same respect for 
>my
> (or any other drummer/percussionist/arrangers) knowledge
> which has been accrued from 40 years of playing in popular styled bands 
>as a
> band leader,
> arranger, composer, producer and instrumentalist(33 of them as a 
> professional).

I don't recall making any statement that I don't have any respect for you 
or any other person's knowledge, as once again, I was pointing out my own 
lack of understanding. If you feel that this indicates me showing a lack 
of respect, I must admit that the connection escapes me entirely. 
BTW,Ringo is one of my favorite drummers, as well as Bill Bueford & Steve 
Gadd if this helps at all. Also, Nick Mason who as well as Ringo both of 
whom "float" better than any other drummers I've ever heard. 

 
> I'm positive I could learn a thing or two from you about the things 
> you have so
> deeply studied and am eager to do so if the chance presents itself.

Happy to be of service at any time.
 
> I wonder why you don't appear open to knowledge  that I (or some other
> drummer) could teach you about the world of rhythm, conversely.

Again, this is not the case. I have been a teacher since I was around 17 
years old & the core of being a teacher is learning. As Socrates once said 
when asked what all his wisdom had gained for him, he replied: " That 
there is so much that I do not know" .

> The concept of a sub pulse is a very simple one and can be demonstrated 
>very
> easily with a few
> choice examples. This concept absolutely defines 

( I am not a big fan of "absolutes" as I have often found when someone 
uses the word that they tend to quickly find the word was ill chosen )

the way human 
> beings respond
> to
> syncopation on a neurophysiological level and is easily 
> demonstrable with sonic
> examples.

If you are saying that syncopation is a "sub-pulse", then it is not 
necessary to explain any further. However, I suspect it is not so simple 
an answer, no?
 
> I'd be happy to share it with you unless you feel your mind is closed.

Now who's being dismissive? 


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