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Re: A = 440 Hz OR 432 Hz?

"The audience thinks your are our of tune dude!"

Its true that Western ears hear so called micro-tunings as out of tune.  But Eastern ears hear the discrete pitches between half-steps where a Westerner will hear only a flat or sharp pitch drifting to the expected diatonic note.  
Indian Ragas are full of musical learning opportunities (as opposed to "horrible" dissonances.)   Listening to good musical use of good micro tunings helps Western musicians to develop the ear for micro–tunings.  

D


On Nov 15, 2012, at 11:27 AM, mark francombe <mark@markfrancombe.com> wrote:

Well thankfully I have never been afflicted by the said disease at all! If you played me a C and told me it was a F I'd believe you, well.. maybe not, but that would be because I would suspect you were up to something and look carefully into your eyes.

If Ive done a gig and my G string is a bit out, Ill play on!! Much more important to rock, than to stop and say.. hang on... I think my G string is loose (might get a laugh tho).

I think this is an interesting thread, and I actually love the sound of dissonance and note clusters and the subtleties of tuning for effect,
But playing conventional music in weird micro tunings (like on the link posted earlier in this thread) just sounds HORRIBLE to my ears... I dont care if its related to the golden mean or the layout of the pyramids of Maya... or exact reproductions of harmonical relationships... The audience thinks your are our of tune dude!

Ive been trying to think of a few references to recording that I think are interesting due to weird tunings, and I cant think of one, but there are a few related things.

The tremolo bends on "Loveless" (My Blood Valentine of course.. my god they have reformed... cant wait for my ears to bleed again!!) I absolutely adore, one of the best albums ever. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lf8j1bUgwJ8&feature=related
And I'm still a sucker for the grungy noize of World Domination Enterprise, where the guitarist tuned to a cassette tape of him playing a tuning that he couldnt get from a tuner, apparently he woke up one day to an out of tune guitar, didnt bother tuning it, and had such a good jam, he taped the tuning and just stuck to it...! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=isi4FYDFfps&feature=related

Or if you prefer, listen to some crapo muso playing some clever assed tricky composition in Just Intonation, and tell me which is best! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ



On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 5:30 PM, astralmnemonics@gmail.com <astralmnemonics@gmail.com> wrote:
''Perfect pitch is not a skill, it's a disease'' haha yes made me laugh, totally agree it's all relative to ratio relationships
-----Original Message-----
Date: Thursday, November 15, 2012 8:18:37 am
To: Loopers-Delight@loopers-delight.com
From: "Stefan Tiedje" <stefantiedje@googlemail.com>
Subject: Re: A = 440 Hz OR 432 Hz?

Am 08.11.12 07:37, schrieb mark francombe:
> Oh really, you think that music that is 8 cents different will do that?
> What happens if you play 100 cents out? Oh yeah... a new key... Cant say
> Ive been feeling those shifts into heart music when I operate My whammy bar.

The difference is 8 Hz! at that pitch its 32 cent. (Max is great to
calculate things like that...)

The only thing I believe is relevant, are the instruments. As Per said
already, his flute doesn't fit to a base 32 cent off the one the
instrument was intended to be tuned to.

All baroque musicians I know tune to lower pitches. Their instruments
are made for that. If you think about it, it's actually not too much of
a mystery to find out which pitches had been used in ancient times. Many
of these old instruments have been kept alive over all these centuries.
Tune them to what sounds best and your heart will open, simply because
you love the sound. It is the sound, not the frequency...

Perfect pitch is not a skill, its a disease... But if you are trained to
perfect pitch @ A 440, any pitch based on 432 will sound wrong by 32
cents. But this also applies to equal tempered scales, if you "perfect"
pitch is trained to that, even a perfect third will not sound perfect...
There are rumors that listening to such tunings can cure this disease...;-)

Stefan

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Mark Francombe
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