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Please try to understand my perspective and not see this as an attempt to disparage others. These are just my thoughts & opinions that are in more of a commercial and market oriented perspective Ive always been something of a salesman of sorts - a marketing major in school. I'm also assuming a manfacturer. Wants to expand its client base to the largest realms possible. It seems that the rule of a larger audience often times means bringing in just a little bit o cheese for the sake of higher returns and greater recognition but hopefully not sacrificing the seriousness of a product line or user base. Id imagine a manufacturer would need to decide the following basic Questions: Who is the target market you're going after ??? where is this mkt - Europe, & or Specific parts of Euro - UK, Belgium, Germany, or Africa, France, Italy or The States ??? Do you really want a Niche or a broad based appeal for your product ?? How much R&D ru willing to invest ??? How solid is the market and what type of product will appeal to the broadest market possible ?? What Pricing and distrubutions structures are the most favorable ??? Some Answers. Dance-Hip-Hop, ... Solid and always growing. Simplicity and sync. Cheaper and Cheaper pricing and Honest and fair ( virtually impossible IMHO ) asian and or mexican manufacturing facilities. Statement: Looping doesn't have a larger audience because its simply tied to artists that don't move a lot of "product" to a large and mass audiences. Don't sacrifice the current giants - they have a place and an important one which is to keep you credible with your constant and existing niche customer base. A lot of times I get the impression that whenever I see a post saying "how come no one else is hip to this "?? I get the feeling of LD preaching to the converted or soon to be converted. Now, obviously, any products success is all about an issue of timing, perception and shrewed marketing manueveers ...ahemmm... ( theres that dirty word again! ) You have to have a need ( a market ) or actively create a need around something or someone who is visable and viable beyond just the conceptual phase of expanding a concept amongst an already sold audience. Looping needs to be presented as simple, straightforward, Non-Esoteric/Non-Cerebreal and rewarding for anyone who may want to explore its potential. This approach automatically but not necessarily leads you toward 1st., the non-musicians, dj's or intermediate level musicians along with the sight reading or technique oriented types you will always have as sort of a captive consumer. Looping also needs to be presented in a similar approach to that which is used on a casio keyboard(IMH-Marketing Opinion) and hawked the way Nike and Addidas sneakers are sold. Label - Streetwise and cool. Just slant it toward 3 levels of involvement Heres a Brainstorm with a lot of certain holes in it: Get rid of the term looping and come up with a catchier simpler phrase. Too many uninitiated people when u mention the term looping go, Huh ??? and you usually end up taking more than 30 seconds explaining it ( obviously because there are many answers and variation on it ) Try to accurately redefine a varied and wide ranging technique that's built around an attractive name and product line. 1.) Standalone portable Device with huge LEDs for the everyday user from ages 4 and up who wants instant and immediate gratification - give them loopable presets and some type of idiot proof interface where they can feel like they have a lot more control over what they actually have been given. Market it as "Jamout or Zone Out in a Box" or something along that line. Give it built in speakers, give it flashing strobe lights too. Price it no higher than $200.00 2.) An Intermediate Level (Portable) Unit SCSI (optionable) , MIDI ports included. Have Preset loops that are loadable and changeable ie. - rock, Hip-Hop - Techno, House, Country, Metal, New age Jazz, etc, grooves, sounds that are layerable but limitable to the loops you can stack and even make em savable on a PC. ... like have it w/a built in overdrive, chorus or flanger and analog type pedal 1sec. Delay effect. Allow it to record up to 8 seconds or more of sound and play back in reverse. Put a multiply mode in it too. Encourage 3rd party SW developers to support you with various add-on devices. Price it no higher than $499.00 It'll be like a drm machine and quasi sampler/sound canvas all in one. 3.)Get together Somethin akin to a jamman or say an echoplex or the BOSS sp202 with all the sophistication and wizardry a pro would expect. Give em lots o knobs and the ability to digitally save and store edit parameters along with full midi functionality Multiply, reverse and ring mod. and random playback or random morphing that would be adjusted & real-time synced to any bpm ya want. Also, remember Its gotta be pitched >from a Fun and ease of use perspective ie. " You'd be amazed at how fast you'd be making music. " Plus from a manufacturers and marketing perspective the upgrades and product life extentions will be endless with tons of cool variations and offshoots until another larger manufacturer copies what youre doing to the tee. Make all your product like samsonite luggaage ! 3.) oops, I don't know how to make my page numbering function stop !!! 4.) Someone earlier mentioned Bjork as a spokeperson - it doesn't necessarily need to be Bjork (though it wouldn't hurt) - it can be people associated w/her or people affiliated with her camp and others of mass note or production noteworthy types. 5.) Remember Hip-Hop Sells and sells Big - Puff Daddy would do wonders for a loop based product line and feed into a market that would only want more and more and more. 6.) 7.) Paul Schaefer would be another good mainstream endorser along with kevin eubanks of leno fame to have your product displayed front and center - all those options would up your public name recognition along w/ key mind value in the public perception. It wouldn't hurt to have someone Mix it up with big or widely recognized people in key mags like musician, Gtr player, or just about anyone of those DnB mags you can get >from a local book or record chain. Matthew Sweet endorses Roland products in their local user mag. Maybe a bi monthly or quarterly periodical which is either paper and or web based devoted to looping would help ( from a manufacturers perspective ) Of this much, Im certain- Word of mouth won't bring looping any further than where it currently stands today. Web Posting and Web Broadcasting in RA wont do it either unless its tied to or part of a focused artist and manufacturer's thrust. I'm just waiting for the all in one box or interface that can can work like a regular music instrument giving ya real time grooves sync, MIDI and expressive/active control over 100% of ya sound. Maybe I should just start manufacturing my own products...nahhhh... too techie :) JP