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In a message dated 28/07/99 22:04:20 GMT Daylight Time, curbfeeler@transworld-lax.com writes: > Now I just read user's manuals and follow user groups > to figure out how to use the manuals. Yep, sometimes I spend hours fiddling with FX and then wish I hadn't ...but sometimes I end up with a patch I can use. then I can spend some time with the patch, play into it and hear what comes out, find out what it does, find out that it does stuff I hadn't foreseen when working it out, ending up with bits of composition and areas for improvisation. Then it all seems worthwhile.(like the day my guitar sounded like a tabla) Part 2 presets? No, I don't like them unless they can be tweaked into something else, ( except reverbs, but even then usually need to change decay time) Partly this is because my main instrument for FX use is non-standard(not a strat), and also my technique is somewhat individual. So what sounds good for me isn't what (most) manufacturers provide. And actually I dislike most of those preset sounds, and I don't want to sound like other musos, even those I like. However, not everyone who uses FX wants to spend valuable music time doing all that tweaking stuff, they'll go straight on to the 'playing with it' stage using a preset or patch. I don't think their approach is in any way inferior to mine. Andy Butler Lexicon Vortex Database (no new sections sorry).. send more patches http://members.aol.com/soundfnr/vortex.htm