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I came across this while reviewing the archives of another list. It's so obvious that I never would have thought of it. If you are using a BALANCED patch bay and find yourself running short of patch points for that one last piece of equipment that you want to squeeze in, use insert cables to make the connections. For example, you could plug the mono plugs into the L&R outputs of your effects processor & plug the TRS connector into the patch bay. You then break the signals out by using another insert cable to complete the routing. You just have to know which signal is going to tip & which is going to sleeve. I wouldn't want to do this more than a couple of times, just to avoid confusion. Patch bays are hard enough to label as it is. John === John Tidwell __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com