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Rob writes... > i know you're just joking ... but i still take offence to this sort of slag-the-drummer mentality. telling the drummer to play to a guitarist's loops (which are likely either overloaded, wimpish-paddish and/or out of time-tune) :-=( is like the drummer telling a guitarist he's cheating because his guitar has frets. ego damage ensues. I'd suggest that pads and ambience are very versatile in loops... they allow other more defined events to co-exist and further define their ambiguity. It's more likely that you'll hear a pad from a guitarist and certainly from a synthesist (drums seem to have a harder time creating pads 8-)). As for the out-of-tune thing... maybe you need to meet some new guitarists! 8-) Anyway... The obvious problem is that one has to listen more carefully AND actually be able to hear the damn loop to respond to it. > but seriously: the problem with live looping/ sequencing is that it can make the music too rigid at times - the damn machines just don't listen to us! I agree... that's the real art of looping. Mixing it up and creating variety. But I'm still willing to believe that it's worth doing. > ironic: i've actually encountered resistance to my use of sequencing and looping from guitarists! The damn hardware is just too damn hard to hug... I've started playing with a couple guys who mostly play jazz standard gigs. After going to Burning Man, the keyboard player came back just dying to get weird so he called me. (that could be a plus or a minus depending... ) It's taken a couple months for them to believe looping is worthwhile but now they're getting into it! We've yet to play with a drummer though, so that's still a hurdle we need to confront. I'm constantly trying to come up with more ability to sneak loops in and out as well as re-sync them after things start to wander... Quick mutes and restarts as well as using multiply and ending with record help create new time sig's and help re-sync things. best, -miko