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Don't feel sad or sorry for me. I am part of a community of really good people I've met out here in the SF Bay area. I just think that a community that's web based isn't the same because you have this degree of anonymity that you don't get when you're physically with people in your community. I remember being at a festival in Ithaca, NY and a small child asked my girlfriend and I for help building stilts (part of a plan for a man to cause mass injuries by giving wood and hammers to small children so they can try to walk on home made stilts). The little girl's mother saw this and came over and nervously apologized but then I saw she recognized me. I was the sock store manager. I walked around Ithaca all the time. I was the guy in that weird band. I was the guy who had coffee all the time with my friends at the local cafes. She ended up asking if we wouldn't mind watching her 4 year old for a bit while she took her 2 year old to the petting zoo. We did and it was a blast. I was pretty good on the stilts too. The point is that I was a part of a community where I couldn't yell "FIRE" in a theater and not suffer. On the Internet, you can do that and people do all the time. It's fine, it's just not the same. Again a strong leader/moderator would help, IMO, but that person hasn't posted in a long time either and has expressed that he by all means dose not want to be that or have that at all on this list. So a community where no one is accountable for anything... just doesn't feel like a community to me. Just a bunch of people talking about roughly the same thing. Mark