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Re: Realistic drum programming/recording for songs

A bottomless pit!
I use NI Maschine to program and Steven Slate Drums Platinum for sounds.  Excellent sort of pop rock and roll sounds.  Takes a fair bit of EQ work for other styles.  

I tried using my old SP12 as a drum controller but the latency was pretty noticeable when triggering MIDI notes.  I had to slip all the notes forward to compensate for the lag. 

Maschine and Slate Drums work great for fairly straight forward stuff. 

I do think the best solution is some kind of V / electronic Drums etc triggering the MIDI stuff. 

One thing I'm thinking about is hiring remote drummers to do tracks on V Drums, or deriving MIDI data from their tracks (Trigger, Drumagog) and doing drum replacement where needed.  Not sure what a good remote drummer costs, though.  

I see opportunity here, Mr. R Walker!

I think the new Ableton can derive MIDI from analog now too.  More utilitarian bang for the buck.

AS Simeon said, you can also step program.  Kontakt has a good step programmer, although I haven't really used it yet - just tinkered a bit.

On Feb 4, 2013, at 8:18 AM, Steven Clements wrote:

I recommend Toontracks Superior Drummer.

There's lots you can do for realistic sounding drums and you can even use their midi drum beats as a start.

On Mon, Feb 4, 2013 at 9:00 AM, Per Boysen <perboysen@gmail.com> wrote:
You're right that it is "endlessly time consuming" to fake a live
drummer. Learning to do the programming right is only step one, then
you need to set the sound right and mix it dynamically. Oh man, what
time consuming activities! I'm wondering why so many people put so
much time into faking something when there are loads of other just as
cool drumming approaches? Just imagine a crappy 505 or 606 with edgy
sound attitude! About a thousand times as easy to make good than
faking a live drummer.

Greetings from Sweden

Per Boysen

On Mon, Feb 4, 2013 at 4:52 PM, Buzap Buzap <buzap@gmx.net> wrote:
> Hi folks
> I'd like to lay down somewhat realistic acoustic drums for song writing purposes (pop ballads, funk, latin, world) in home recording environment.
> Currently, I program drums in Logic Pro. I also have an acoustic drum set at work where I can play basic drum grooves that reasonably ok.
> However, I don't have a good sounding kit and have no experience whatsoever with drum micing.
> My current approach is basically similar to this:
> http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/sep10/articles/drum-prog.htm
> First, I lay down basic patterns in Logic Ultrabeat. Then, I tweak the timing in piano roll. Last - and this is the most time consuming part - I tweak velocities, create ghost notes, rolls in HyperEdit mode.
> How should I proceed next?
> My current thoughts:
> A.
> Get a real hi-hat machine + snare, set them up with mics. (e-drum cymbals never sound realistic enough for me, don't like snares on e-drums either for funky stuff).
> For the rest, use e-drum kick pedals, pads etc.
> B.
> Go the software road (i.e. Superior Drummer) and dive deeper into drum programming.
> With drum programming, I can get fairly realistic results. I'm very flexible, can start with basic patterns and can refine/change things over time. However, the process is time consuming & seemingly endless...
> With real drum set, there is the beauty of playing immediately the right groove with a gut feeling. However, the home recording environment (space, neighbours) and the mic set-up can be tricky.
> I know the best solution is to get a real drummer in a studio environment. But laying down stuff quickly (still realistically as possible) is more important than having the perfect drum track.
> Would like to hear your experience & advice on this subject.
> best regards
> Buzap