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wow, man, this is not my day... Most readers here probably dont understand at all what is going on (trying to give a balanced review): In 1996, Andre (at the time: "The Man Himself") was the first person to post to this list! And in the first month he typed for example: "This would be an ideal way to try and compile the most definitive works by the most prominent loopists (is that what we're supposed to call ourselves?)" A month later, I posted "linguistic again", trying to define the use of words, but in vain... Since then we had many discussions of the kind, often bringing up interesting philosophical and marketing and whatnot analysis... and a lot of gear and tricks and laughter... 40-70 posts every day, during years! in October '02 I started the thread: "Please lets all sit together now and define what we do!" ...which did not work out, because a part of the list members (not just Andre!) felt that any common name or definition for the kind of music that most people on this list create would also be a limitation and exclusion of the ones that do not quite fit into the definition. True. A problem. With words in general and especially description of art! Marketing through genres inhibits a lot of non main stream music! A big variety of musical styles and looping tools are used, so neither approach would lead to a satisfactory definition of what everyone does here. As a result, some agreed to call what they do "Live Looping", and others did not like this name or gathering. An unpleasant situation that was never solved. Some energy was lost. Some negativity came up. But it never came to any discrimination, did it? No one here was limited in his creativity and freedom to play and market the music they want and call them the way they want! No one was rejected from a festival because he did not match some definition - after all, we still dont have such a definition... What we do is much more important than words, no? Still, the words exploded again. I am very sorry for that. >I'm sorry to hear that I was apparently responsible for your losing >three months, Matthias. I did not say that. Would be co-responsible at maximum, and I should not have brought that up, sorry. >Maybe it would be easier if everyone thought >the same things, felt the same feelings, and understood the same >unspoken beliefs. certainly would >Unfortunately, I'm a pretty dumb person, what an understatement of one of the most intelligent persons I met! >so sometimes >I need things explained to me, and sometimes it takes an explanation >that goes into more depth and detail than "It is this way because this >is the way we say that it is." this was never said, we went very deeply into the question... >For the time being, I don't want to be a negative vibe merchant - >especially to the people whose work and music I've spent innumerable >hours trying to be supportive and enlightening about over the course of >eight and a half years. This is exactly the way I feel! sure man, it was a very creative time! Peace Matthias >Matthias Grob wrote: >> I put a lot of energy into creating a mutual support organization to >> inform the world about looping music and make looping musicians life >> easier. >> The ones that did not like the idea (mainly for the lack of a hard >> definition) won. Also because Kevin left Gibson. I lost 3 months. >> But what did you win, really? >> Well, I have more things to do, maybe things I can do better... :-) >> >> -- >> >> ---> http://Matthias.Grob.org -- ---> http://Matthias.Grob.org